[Raised $200 million] Ep.109 - The First 100 with Kyle Hanslovan, the Founder of Huntress | The Power of Transparency

Kyle Hanslovan is the Founder of Huntress, a software company whose mission is to help Managed Service Providers (MSPs) quickly detect advanced cyber threats. With your endpoint agent and cloud-based analysis engine, you discover breaches before they cause downtime, costly cleanup, and damaged reputations. Huntress software deploys within seconds through the customers’ existing Remote Monitoring and Management software, hunts down infections that slip past their firewalls/antivirus, and creates remediation tickets (not alerts) directly in their service boards. Huntress has raised $200 million to date.

Where to find Kyle Hanslovan:

• Website: Managed Cybersecurity Platform for SMBs and IT Providers | Huntress

• LinkedIn: Kyle Hanslovan | LinkedIn

Where to find Hadi Radwan:

• Newsletter: Principles Friday | Hadi Radwan | Substack

• LinkedIn: Hadi Radwan | LinkedIn

If you like our podcast, please don't forget to subscribe and support us on your favorite podcast players. We also would appreciate your feedback and rating to reach more people.

We recently launched our new newsletter, Principles Friday, where I share one principle that can help you in your life or business, one thought-provoking question, and one call to action toward that principle.

Please subscribe Here.

It is Free and Short (2min).

Transcript

Let's do it. Let's do it. Broadcasting from around the world. You're listening to the first 100 a podcast on how founders acquired their first 100 paying customers. Here's your host Hadi Rodwan. Good to have you on the show, Kyle. How are you doing today? I'm staying out of trouble. How about you? Same, same. I hope you're having a great summer. We're trying to get this recording for a while, but here we are. Kyle Hanslovan is the founder of Huntress, which is a software company on a mission to help what we call manage service providers to quickly detect advanced cyber threats. Kyle, you've raised around 200 million to date. Tell us if we're an eight year old listening to this. What does Hunters do? Eight-year-olds know all about the small businesses that they go to, right? They don't understand the difference between enterprise. So when I talk to my kids, or maybe even my mom, who sometimes has a technical understanding of an eight-year-old, I usually keep it simple and say, look, hackers go after the small businesses of the world, but they don't have access to really sharp people. Hunters provides both that people and the technology to kind of protect the 99% of businesses that usually fall below. you know, kind of that poverty line. Obviously an eight-year-old wouldn't know what a poverty line is, but anybody who's non-technical understands that, hey, the little companies of the world happen to need protection too. And if you think about it, there's far more of that backbone of the economy than there are the Fortune kind of 2000. So, Hunter's covers about 120,000 of those small and mid-sized businesses. How serious is it today? with these cyber attacks because we know for a fact that when we sleep at night, we lock our doors. But till now, it's still less relevant to think about the seriousness of a cyber threat. So how serious is it for a listener who doesn't know what it means? I like that you used an analogy about the physical world. You can think of locking doors or closing windows or a bank, right? Putting cameras outside. And so the hardest part that I try to convey is not only is the cyber threat. real. Attackers both exist and they have the motive and they are actively doing this. It's kind of just a little bit more complex than locking a door or a window. There's a lot more facets. It would be like, how do you secure a city from not having crime? Because cybersecurity or protecting businesses have kind of a similar attack surface. So my quick answer would be, yeah, it's very valid. And the unfortunate part is threat actors understand economies of scale. So that means why go after one big business that takes two years when I can go after hundreds of small businesses and get the same financial results. So I think that's the legacy that's kind of happened over the last 10 years is that shift has gone from the enterprise now down to the average Joe and they can't just lock their front door or turn on their camera. Makes a lot of sense. The security categories like vulnerability scanning, pen testing, breach and attack simulation, attack surf management. All of these categories are not new. If I'm today a small enterprise looking to find a vendor to protect me, what is the core thing I need to look at? And how is your company, Hunter, different than the other big players out there? Do you mind if I give you a hot take instead of just like a boilerplate? Let's do it. Most of those businesses that fall below that enterprise, you mentioned small enterprise, mid-market. they wouldn't know the difference, right? If you and I look at a Lamborghini, a Porsche, and a Volkswagen, we know the differences. They're very apparent. We know of their legacy. But cybersecurity marketing, most folks just don't know the difference between those three models. And one of the biggest things for us is not requiring folks to understand that, focusing more on the outcome. And the outcome is not perfect. Being realistic with your marketing and realistic with your messaging that you're probably still gonna get compromised. Similar to like the doctor. The doctor would never say, you're never gonna get sick, you're never gonna get cancer. Like you wouldn't believe that person. But for some reason in cybersecurity products, people do believe those products. So it turns out if you focus a little bit more on like relatable outcomes of, hey, I'm gonna make sure that you're as productive as possible. Just like the doctor would say, I'm gonna keep you as fit as possible if you follow my advice and let me take care of some of the more mundane. That's a lot more realistic. And then when somebody does get cancer, right? Similar to having an incident, you know you can't really stop somebody from getting cancer, but you wanna be able to find it as early as possible before the situation's terminal. Not enough folks talk to that audience about, you know, these things in less technical terms and say, I can't stop you from getting cancer. But when you do get it, when you do have that incident, I'm gonna make sure that you're back up and running in a couple of days and I'm gonna minimize the threat instead of it also getting terminal. And so you'll notice in most of my words that I use, I try to stay away from even though I'm a super like technical nerd, nobody wants to hear that. They wanna hear it in relatable outcomes. And I think that's where most entrepreneurs get it wrong too. Amazing. If we were today to look at people who work in companies around security, we're talking about maybe the CISOs, the CIOs, when they want to prioritize critical security findings and decide what to fix and what not to fix. How are you helping them in this prioritization? Or maybe they shouldn't prioritize, they should fix everything. What's your framework of thought on this? Well, I think you and I both know you can't fix everything. You have finite resources, finite people. I always ask, like, even though I cut my teeth as an offensive cyber warfare operator, I was literally conducting cyber operations to gather intelligence. I can't come in there and say, hire a whole bunch of me's. One, I don't exist for talent. And then when these companies do, if they're lucky enough that they do have a CISO, because they're big enough to have that, they are acutely aware they can't just hire more talent and they don't have the budget. So a lot of the conversation is very realistic saying, I know you want to do more. What if I could take the most mundane things that cause your kind of most senior cybersecurity practitioners to get bored and to quit and leave? What if I could free you up from the monotony? And what if I could elevate your most junior IT people, which those are a lot more readily accessible. There's a lot of that good talent. And I said, hey, if I can enable the most junior tech talent to kind of respond with my capability, right, my efficiency, that kind of levels the playing field. And so I hope to maybe draw that analogy full circle or that scenario full circle. When I do talk to a CISO, I say, look, I know talent. Retention and talent hiring are some of your biggest problems. And I know you want to solve some of these really exciting things that are buzzworthy and in the news. What if I can free up your most senior security people to solve those hard problems for the business? And for the price of a product, I bring my security expertise and enable your most junior IT people to perform like those cybersecurity rock stars. And that's a very good value proposition. You know, notice I didn't go into any of the tech. I didn't talk about what vulnerabilities, what we're looking, but once you get somebody that understands the value prop, then they're excited enough to ask how. And I think, at least for me, if I think about entrepreneurs, what they usually get wrong in kind of the first 100 deals. They usually don't know that, right? The first and even me during my first 100 deals, I wouldn't have pitched it that way. This is what it sounds like $200 million in capital later and 100,000 clients later. It wasn't that smooth in the beginning. Take us to the early days of Pinterest. How did you hone your value proposition and how did you find the early, let's say excited customers to work with you? So part of being a little bit of a shady hacker, which means you're constantly testing. Can I get in? Can I steal the password? Can I steal the intelligence? You get used to failing fast, but it turns out you can get a lot further if you don't. Fail, right? Even though everybody says fail fast, fail often, not failing gets you a lot further. So the first things I did, I just talked to as many people as possible. And even though there's a lot of entrepreneurs that have the perspective of don't share your secret, don't give away the secret sauce, I tried to give my secret sauce out to everybody. And what happened was is the end result. is most folks told me where my ideas were very bad or at least forced me to challenge and rethink my ideas. And combining that with failing fast and failing often, meaning going out and talking directly to prospects, being as the CEO and founder of the first salesman, that caused me to really learn very quickly how wrong I was and being okay with being wrong, being okay to listen. And that's embarrassing. Remember I said I went after the smallest businesses first. We're talking businesses under 2,500 employees. sometimes down to like 20 employees and having a 20 employee company saying, I don't get what you're talking about. Why don't you talk to the people I outsourced my IT to? That was a really hard lesson to learn in the beginning because all I wanted to talk about was the tech and all they wanted to talk about was how do they make more money? And so I had to learn. Couple of follow up questions on these because I tried from these conversations with different guests to decipher how can I increase my conversion rate between When I try to reach out to potential customers to learn about their pain points, how can I get them to speak to me? Because I could do cold outreaches, warm outreaches, cold emails. I can do a hundred, a thousand, maybe five, ten, fifteen would respond. What did you do early on to get more people engaged with you? Any special sauce you could share with us? So all founders have their own strong points. and conversely, they're very weak points. I was getting much better at publicly speaking at this time. I was approachable and I had learned early enough on through some advice from mentors and other founders that if you can both compliment somebody at what they're doing and instead of coming in with the solution, come in with humility and ask those people for advice, it almost triggers a psychological result where they want to help. they can usually think through a time where they have also been not the smart person. And so coming through my call and my pitch, some of these small businesses originally sounded like, hey, I researched so and so, or I learned about you through your local chamber of commerce or whatever accolade they had. And I was impressed by it. I'm a budding entrepreneur that's still trying to figure things out. I did win the World Series of Hacking, so I'd established some credibility by throwing that in there. But I would also caveat that I don't really know how to be an entrepreneur at this point. I've got some ideas, could you give me some time to beat up my idea? And what happened is this, those in the beginning and truly the first hundred deals, that humility gained trust. And it also gave somebody else the chance to be able to give feedback and have ownership of my product, which means they felt attached and wanted to see me succeed too. because it was their own success, right? They wanna see their own feedback pay off. And so my secret sauce would be, it's almost a little bit of psychology and the other is a whole lot of humility. Compliment them on what they're great at, tell them why you respect their time, establish your own credibility because something makes you special. Everybody has something special and then end it kind of with that, would you be willing to donate a little bit of your time to help me solve that problem? That made the difference between just me having customers and rabid partners, people who wanted to see my success because now their feedback and their own credibility was tied to my success and it didn't always turn into deals. But the people they would introduce me to almost always turned into deals. That's something most people I think get wrong and I'm very thankful that I happened to get lucky and learn it. Makes a lot of sense. The second follow-up question is practically on that thin line or balance between when you're asking these questions and getting a feedback that you don't want to hear. And you might fall into the trap of maybe a confirmation bias. Like you want to confirm your hypotheses and you're saying that those people don't know versus actually the people know and it's time to pivot. How do you balance between when to give up and then when to keep pushing? So I'll call out two things because I think your question is very, very good. The first one is even if somebody's opinion is converse with yours, meaning not just like it doesn't align, meaning it parallels, I'm talking about it's the exact opposite of yours, giving that person a chance to share their feedback and then telling them why you appreciate it, beating up the idea together, those people will still evangelize for you. And even if they don't buy your product, they'll go that direction. Sometimes there's an urge as a founder to educate. I made the mistake in the beginning of doing a lot more telling people why I thought they were maybe not correct. Notice I didn't say wrong, but not correct. And it goes a lot further when you can show them, hey, I understand what you're saying on this end. I'm seeing this observation. Can I show you this observation that seems to run counter to your point that I'm trying to make heads or tails of? Now all of a sudden your group bought in and sometimes you might actually flip somebody and they say, oh, you're onto something. You just proved me wrong, but since you showed me and didn't just try to opinionate and give me a tell, right? If you give somebody and tell somebody opinion, you're creating friction. And so the second part of that, right, is at the end of the day, life blood of your company is revenue. So you have to know when to quit these conversations and sometimes you run into that converse feedback that you'll never be aligned. I have some people that were not my customers maybe and kind of even didn't believe in what I was doing because they met me so early. But if you stick at it long enough, like I'm eight years into this, many of them are now my customers, even if they didn't become that customer in the first five years. So I don't want to caveat too heavily, but not all opinions matter. You need to be respectful, but not all opinions matter. Excellent advice. And I love the fact that you're stacking relationships, which eventually... you know, would build up. This is what they told me when I started my newsletter. They said, the more content you put out there, the more you're stacking content, eventually people would start reading, sharing, and then your newsletter would grow organically, which is exactly after eight years, what you mentioned, stacking a lot of your value out there. If we go back to the early days, what were your early acquisition strategies that scaled with you? And then what did you do that's non-scalable, but you had to do it early on because maybe it's a founder, let's say, strategy at the beginning. Yeah, at the beginning, your company probably should not be solving for scale. It should be solving for product market fit, unless you're doing something like hyperviral B2C or you're going after calm flies, deals that are in the cents or in the dollars as opposed to deals in the thousands of dollars. And the reason I say that is I read Guy Kawasaki's Art of the Start 2.0. That was one of my first books I read. And I didn't read a lot of books. I know some founders, they live in them. I read only a select few and I gathered the tidbits that related to me, inspiration. And one of the points that they shared talked about the Airbnb founders of how rough things went when they initially came up with a double-sided market idea that, hey, Nobody wants to use all of their house. Some people want to make money on it. Some people don't want to stay in something as fancy as a hotel. That's the double-sided. But what happened is the early days of Airbnb, people didn't take great pictures. They didn't clean up their house very well. And it was very dirty and it was very kind of not welcoming. I wouldn't want to stay there. I would feel unsafe. And that was an issue. So very similar to those founders who went in and started cleaning and taking pictures to help get those first deals. which then grew competition amongst the Airbnb, you know, listers, that can't scale. And my experience was very similar. I did hacking demonstrations, like when I said I would show, not tell. And then I got better and realized, okay, the hacking demonstration they like, but I could record that. And now I could make it more succinct. Now how can I enable somebody else, maybe my first and going from founder sales. to that sales rep, right? My first sales engineers or my first account executives. And what I was doing is I was packaging my magic into a very succinct story and also thinking through as a founder, how do I enable this salesperson that isn't a hacker, isn't a sexy founder to still feel just as credible? And I learned that from the Airbnb side that the stuff they did, they can't clean houses and take pictures for everybody else, but what they did is they inspired, they packaged it up. and caused the other Airbnb sellers to take great pictures. And that became viral. And what happened is I distilled my magic the same way. And I think that should be part in the beginning. You don't need to scale for your first hundred deals, but if you're not learning what is the magic of your unscalable activities, and then thinking through how do I package and distill these and allow anybody to do this, you might only get to your next 100 deals as opposed to your next thousand deals. Hindsight is 2020. If you were to go back in time, is there a failure that you would undo? The whole founding of Huntress is built on repeated failure. So there's a lot that I would say I would undo. Maybe I'll tell the most embarrassing one and then I'll think through if I've got one. Like for instance, I mentioned I was calling these small businesses and I was given a pitch. Hey, I love your expertise. I had won the World Series of Hacking. I think I can help, but I really don't know. Do you have the time? Actually, some people said, I love what you're doing. but I outsource all of my technical stuff to somebody who takes care of this for me. It took me like five phone calls in a row. Like it was a long time for this to get to that level that I realized, why don't I call the people that they're outsourcing to? Like, I don't know why that took so long, but it's like really embarrassing if you think about it in hindsight. And I think where I would change wouldn't be that one particular action, but more of the motion. If you can identify people giving you negative feedback or start being better aware of where you're having issues, take the time to explore those and do it faster than what I did, which was I just kept at it over and over and over and it took me way too long to realize. Stop going to each individual small and mid-sized business. And why don't you go to somebody who manages the IT for 100 businesses? Also when you close one of those customers, you get like all 100 businesses as well. So it's much more efficient. I think for me, I really wish I would have put more time in understanding my failures instead of just shrugging them off. I should have been more analytical. Amazing. What's the principle that you live by that has served you well in your journey? For us, it's transparency. I know that coming from like a intelligence background where I worked at the NSA, they don't do anything that's transparent. It's all very clandestine. So that was an important thing to me. What I didn't realize if you can be transparent and push it up to its boundaries, not to the point that you ever cross somebody's privacy. A good example of this would be like, we recently just kicked off a Series C. When that Series C, we gave our full team and like, you know, full access to all the metrics, the finances, and we don't just do that, for instance, on a Series C. Every board meeting, it's the last Friday of the month, the first Tuesday of the month, which is today. that we're recording this, it happens to be the town hall. And I will go share my entire unredacted board slides, all the finances, where we're doing really well, and most importantly, where we're failing. And every time I go back and I look at that principle of all the things I could do right and wrong, you just get so much more trust when somebody believes in why you're doing it because you are transparent. And there is only one truth, right? When you're transparent. If you're transparent, but lying, that's not really transparent. And so for me, That radical candor paired with radical transparency has done us really well and helped us scale a lot faster than most companies. Amazing principle, even though a lot of people are very cautious in sharing their numbers because competition is sitting around, journalists, people bad mouth you, trolls over the internet, you name it, that transparency becomes sometimes a nightmare for a lot of people, even though it's the right thing to do because you need to build trust, right? And I didn't even realize I was saying that to you earlier with the case that I said, share your intellectual property, share your most sensitive details because you'll get both trust validation feedback. And I think this boils down to that principle that the only thing that separates companies is their execution, right? And if you can get over that, get over the ridicule and just say, I was transparent. You can't really get faulted for that. Even when you're doing bad, you can say, I told you I was doing bad. I've had plenty of bad times, but I'm still a company creeping up on over a hundred million in recurring revenue, and I've had plenty of bad times. So don't let that hold you back. Or that's what I would share with the audience that's listening right now. Amazing advice. Thank you for doing that. Did young Kyle ever exhibit any flashes of entrepreneurships early on? Gosh, this is where we get into that shady gray area. I was thankful I joined the armed forces at 17, because when you have to do the polygraph, They ask you, tell us all these questions back to your 18th birthday. And when you're 17, they never ask. But I always had this hustle. It was something, you name it. I would go to Costco and I would resell candy or stuff at school. You weren't allowed to, it wasn't an official fundraiser, but it started there. More nefarious things were like, you know, maybe helping people with school paperwork and stuff along those lines. I was a bookworm, so I always had some of that, but it was always this like right level of It was hustle mentality combined with like that opportunity, that gap. And I turned out that going for the gray areas of like bootleg candy at school or doing people's like homework or helping them do nefarious things, that's a little bit too gray. But if you can find gray niche markets, like for me, there's a hundred other great companies that go after the enterprise. My gray area was what about all the companies they don't go after? And it turned out that was Greenfield. So just like I had the Greenfield opportunity of again, supply and demand for candy at school, that's not much different. So I think there's probably some elements or steel threads that from me as a scrappy kind of broke child all the way to kind of a scrappy broke founder, they remain true. I love that mentality, especially when you go out to pitch your idea, there's probably a lot of VCs that would have told you, you know what, large enterprises is where the money is. It's very hard to crack the small guys there. They don't have a budget, yet you persevered and you pushed there. What sort of mental characteristics do you have so that you could hear, say, you know what? I believe in the idea. So going back to it, like, you want to listen to feedback and venture capital or private equity, whoever if you raise capital from, for us, it's all VC. They want to pattern match to what works. Most of the time, unfortunately, that means white males, Ivy League schools, building tech, great margins to enterprise. That's the pattern. That's not the only pattern, but that's the majority. And I didn't have it, right? I was military guy without a formal education. I was at least white male, so I had some of that privilege, but then going after the SMB. And for me, it motivated me to find the right partner. It was actually one of the best disqualifiers when someone would tell me, Let me tell you, like in my Series A, for instance, I had two very good term sheets. We took the one from the, most people would call the second tier investor. To me, it was the perfect tier investor. It was the right investor for the right market that had the right belief, the right experience. And even though the investor that I took in Series B happened to be more of the pattern matching to that one in Series A I passed over, there's a right time and right place for that investor too. So... If I could give two things is not only your mental state, you have to be able to hear no over and over. You have to be slightly wrong. As a founder, everyone is gonna tell you you're wrong. Even your parents will tell you you're wrong. Your friends will tell you you're wrong. Sometimes they're right. I would just go back to testing and using data because if you're able to go through and say, I don't care if I'm right or wrong, and that goes to your pivot question you asked earlier. If you're just going in and saying, I have a hypothesis, I'm going to test. You're not wed to that hypothesis. You're doing an assessment. And if turns out the investors are right, you can just pivot and no one will be upset, especially if you're transparent. And so that mental mindset of being okay with two things, some people will disagree with you and they're right. But really the thing nobody talks about is what if they disagree with you and you're right? You just saved yourself. Could you imagine if you would have gotten to a partnership with someone who didn't agree with you, who someone wasn't bought into your idea? You don't want to marry that financially, right? And so I would strongly encourage, right? Embrace your failures. They're probably not the right fit. And if they are the one that's right, make sure you're not wed to your idea. Test and be okay to pivot. You mentioned that you've won the World Series of Hacking. Tell us first, how do you get to become a hacker? And then second, what does it take to win a World Series? So... As a hacker, people immediately think, right, you're in a basement, the room is dark, you've got your black hoodie on. But I actually believe hacker, especially nowadays, is more of a mentality. That as somebody who is told things are one way and they want to prove whether that's true or not, notice it's that scientific method, right? Some of our first hackers in the world probably weren't tech people. They were probably great folks like inventors. Maybe you're Benjamin Franklin's. And if you think about like, the mathematicians in like early Persia, those are some of real hackers in the world. They were willing to say, I don't believe this, right? Galileo being able to challenge some of the astrophysics in the world, et cetera. Some of these things that I'm going for is hackers are folks that want to push the boundary and prove whether it's right or wrong. I was hacker in the literal sense of my job was creating tools to gather intelligence. both for counterterrorism missions and foreign intelligence missions and helping deliver valuable outcomes. Meaning counterterrorism means saving lives and foreign intelligence usually means gathering the intelligence to make the world safer. So those two things you can't really mess up. And so what's nice is me taking that mentality and I started out as a techie. I joined the Air Force at 17. I had the opportunity to join an intelligence apparatus that the US calls the NSA. I worked with them, they put a lot of training into me and that mentality, right, of how do you steal data, et cetera, prepared me to not just have a successful career in the service, but those commercial like hacking, that's exactly what it is, it's problem solving. It's how do you within a finite time or a finite boundaries of this problem, how do you solve it really quick? And sometimes, by the way, it was like ciphers or solving Sudoku puzzles. So if I go back to it, It wasn't the technical tools alone that made me a great hacker to win that DEF CONS capture the flag. It was the ability to problem solve, to be open-ended, and a whole lot of drive too. You can't underestimate, I like to call it grit, but you've gotta be slightly crazy to go wanna stay up 72 hours straight and do hacking. That's how that World Series wins. That doesn't make sense to most people. But for somebody who has the drive, has the ambition and appreciates problem solving, and I think really, It's a perfect formula for somebody to create a good company, right? You have to have those same problems. You have same hustle. Sometimes you have to sleep a little bit less. And so I'm really thankful for those opportunities. I don't think everybody gets them, but for me, I just happened to get dealt the right cards. And when I kind of had to flop, I learned to pivot. Amazing. In your downtime, when you're not working, what's an activity that you love to do? All right, I'm gonna give you the short and the long. The short. of it is I am only about a year and a half into learning what does Kyle like to do. What do I personally like to do? Because I'll be straight, most of my career, if I wasn't working hacking, I was doing malware research or trying to educate myself, or I was doing those capture the flag hacking competitions, that's not very balanced. I wouldn't recommend that to anybody. And so for me, as a dad of three, my kids are 19, 17, and 12. You could imagine I'm investing a lot more in my family and a lot more in myself. So I go to the gym now, gym three days a week. I like to walk my dogs and those seem like very simple, like not great hobbies, but the important part of it is it's giving your mind a chance to focus just on something else, especially if that something else is important to you. And for me, spending time with my family, spending time investing in myself, like that is. And so that gives me the release. So I wish I said I like did something exciting like parachuting or. some extreme sport, but the reality is I just try to keep myself balanced. I like to eat good food and that works for me. Amazing, Kyle. Thank you for stopping by. One last question. What's next for Kyle and Huntress? All right, let's take those two parts. What's next for Huntress is simple. I mentioned that we're protecting 120,000 mid-size and small businesses of the world. There is over 33 million small businesses just in the US, let alone globally. So I've got a lot of work to do. looking at the opportunities for being a public company, but that still is just the beginning. So now is the time I focus on scale, the right process, the right people, going international, building multiple products. We now have three products instead of just one. Those are things you don't do your first couple of years. You probably shouldn't because you would only be mediocre. So that's what Huntress is going. For me personally, it's about getting the right team and the right balance and making sure that, you know, I sprinted the first half of this marathon. And in many times, my co-founders and I, we almost burnt out. I think most people don't consider how real that is, that if you want to make a truly iconic company of consequence, you have to go marathon after marathon after marathon. And how good of a difference can you make to the world if you sprint it and burn out before you even cross your first finish line, let alone the endless finish lines that come after. So for me, I'm focusing on like personal health. I'm focusing on happiness and that'll allow me to do those huntress goals I've led with. Amazing. If our listeners wants to add value to you, where can they reach you? I'm super active on both LinkedIn and X, I guess Twitter, whatever we call it these days. And I actually try to respond. So yeah, big fan of being able to give people hot takes and advice on how I mess things up rather than advice on what worked. We'll put all of these in the show notes. Thank you for stopping by, Kyle. We wish you the best of luck in your journey. Hey, I appreciate the thoughtful conversation. These were great. Thank you so much for listening to the first 100. We hope it inspired you in your journey. If you're enjoying the podcast, please subscribe to our podcast on Apple iTunes, Stitcher, Google Play, or Spotify, and share it with a friend starting their entrepreneurship journey. Leave us a five-star review. Your support will help spread our podcast to more viewers.